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[MdaG]

Originally posted by R Havell+Jun 17 2005, 11:20 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (R Havell @ Jun 17 2005, 11:20 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Stroggy@Jun 17 2005, 11:58 AM
Well everybody knows that oxygen burns when exposed to it in large quantities. However even the way we perceive it now around us, it burns and corrodes our skin (much like rust), now it has this effect on pretty much every creature, so wouldn't evolution have made the creatures adapted to their surroundings (oxygen) so that it wouldn't be toxic?

It would take a long time to die because of this effect, people die of old age, starvation or being eaten long before they feel the effeects of this. Therefore, there is no evolutionary pressure to develop resistance to this, somebody with this resistance would still die of old age or whatever before it became useful. With life span increasing as it is, we will eventually live to be old enough to be harmed by this effect. At that point, anyone who is resistant will have an advantage and so this advantage will be passed on (if, of course, that person can still have children at their extremely old age). That's the way evolution works, advantages are only passed on to the next generation when they are useful. [/b][/quote]
What he said.

[The Fifth Horseman]

[quote]I had a French teacher last year, atheist. He was an example for the "bad" atheist. he didn't believe in life after death, he believed he would just vanish, he said he therefore refused to get children and wasn't interested in wife either. He said that this is his one and only life and he's not going to be dictated by others while he's living it
what did all that lead to? it led to him being a downright jerk. [/QUOET]
I am a sort of atheist myself. Not that I do not believe into existence of higher being/beings, neither I do not believe in that there is no afterlife. However, I have no reason to be sure that god/gods and afterlife do really exist. Thus I am in sort of a limbo of belief.

[Sly]

Originally posted by the_fifth_horseman@Jun 17 2005, 06:40 AM
However, I have no reason to be sure that god/gods and afterlife do really exist. Thus I am in sort of a limbo of belief.

FYI, That is an agnostic.

[Stroggy]

But it does gradually make us weaker, causing out bones to over time become brittle,... wouldn't evolution deem this a factor worth improving on?

[Sly]

Originally posted by Stroggy@Jun 17 2005, 06:49 AM
But it does gradually make us weaker, causing out bones to over time become brittle,... wouldn't evolution deem this a factor worth improving on?

It's called the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics. Everything degrades over time. Evolution supposedly can overcome the 2nd Law, but no one has proven how this can happen.

[Havell]

Brittle bones are caused by lack of calcium, how would something that affects the skin have a bad effect on our bones? Anyway, like I said, it's obvisously not important enough, either that or nobody's had the mutantion that would cause resistance yet. Evolution isn't some kind of higher force, it's just something that happens.

[Indignus IV]

why are we going into metabolism and thermodynamics? maybe this topic is going waaaaaay off topic.

[Havell]

Originally posted by Sly+Jun 17 2005, 12:55 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Sly @ Jun 17 2005, 12:55 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Stroggy@Jun 17 2005, 06:49 AM
But it does gradually make us weaker, causing out bones to over time become brittle,... wouldn't evolution deem this a factor worth improving on?

It's called the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics. Everything degrades over time. Evolution supposedly can overcome the 2nd Law, but no one has proven how this can happen. [/b][/quote]
This is an extremely common misquotation of the 2nd law by creationists. They quote is as "Everything tends towards enthropy (chaos, basically)", the actual law states "In a closed system, everything tends towards enthropy.".
The omission of this tiny phrase complete changes it's meaning, it's like saying "It is illiegal to buy alcohol in the UK", when the actual law says "If you are below the age of 18, it is illiegal to buy alcohol in the UK."

EDIT: For an example of this, think of a apple. If you leave it in a dustbin (closed system0 in will go mouldy and deacy (ie, chaotic). If you leave it outside (open system) it will grow into an extremely ordered thing, known as an apple tree.

[Iron_Scarecrow]

Certainly sounds like it to me. Being off topic that is.

[Quintopotere]

Originally posted by Titan@Jun 16 2005, 11:54 PM
But Jesus beeing the son of god? Heck no. If i was "god" and i where to send my "son" to a caothic earth, the FIRST thing i would have done, was to make him immortal. (might have added a few lasers and a minor nuke or smth)

But if God come like an immortal, demonstrating his power to everyone and so on, we will be forced to believe... so, no more freedom for us! If you love someone you'll not turn him in a slave...

Life and freedom are something i can't renounce and the same for you, i suppose!

Anyway, this topic begin to be too long for my poor english... maybe i'll stop to read it, but if you all will arrive at the conclusion that Earth is 6000 years old, tell me! Since this news i'll remain evolutionist...