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[TotalAnarchy]

Originally Posted by Professor Oak

From now on, could I recommend that the term 'The Ultimate Doom' or 'TUD' be used to describe the first Doom game, so that people will not get confused between that and the 1 episode shareware edition?

That would be totally incorrect. Both Ultimate Doom and original Doom have the right to be on AB.

[Professor Oak]

Originally Posted by TotalAnarchy

That would be totally incorrect. Both Ultimate Doom and original Doom have the right to be on AB.

However, the chances of getting an original copy of Doom is near impossible, The Ultimate Doom is the more well-known version of it.

[TotalAnarchy]

Originally Posted by Professor Oak

However, the chances of getting an original copy of Doom is near impossible, The Ultimate Doom is the more well-known version of it.

That doesn't allow us to change game titles... If you can't find the original Doom, then just review Ultimate Doom, which will be referred to as Ultimate Doom onsite. I know there was the case with Blood-One Unit Whole Blood, but what you suggest is actually the opposite of that.

[Professor Oak]

Originally Posted by TotalAnarchy

That doesn't allow us to change game titles... If you can't find the original Doom, then just review Ultimate Doom, which will be referred to as Ultimate Doom onsite.

Sounds fair to me, by the way, could we at least refer to the full version of Doom as 'Doom' and the shareware version as 'Doom 1' in line with the full version? The reason I'm asking this is because of the IWAD structure with shareware being 'doom1.wad' and the full version being 'doom.wad'.

[Japo]

Originally Posted by DarthHelmet86

Doom and Wolfenstien had a shareware Episode 1, with the other episodes greyed out in the level select menu. Paying for the game unlocked those levels (wether they were there all along or not I don't know) this makes it feel much more like a demo, a taster of the full game. Games like Commander Keen gave you a .exe that was a whole game for the shareware title, buying the extra games meant getting extra .exes to run the new games.

Seems like a big difference to me, the Doom shareware was a demo of a full game, Commader Keen 1 was a full game, with other games that could be brought to finish the story. But why argue about it here, if there is a game someone wants on the site they can request or offer it and we can decide then if it belongs on the site. Doom 1 is sold, offering the Shareware version will just lead to be people complaining that they didn't get the whole game.

Approving or rejecting a game has never been about which particular updater was online at the moment, and how did he "feel like" about the game.

If it's to be that these games are rejected, OK, but it has to be a definite criterion. About games with expansions, I still think they will catch us pants down, if we don't decide how to handle them. So far we have been deciding on the already abandoned ones on a per case basis, instead of having any rule like for the rest, as we should.

[Professor Oak]

It has been agreed that Doom and The Ultimate Doom are two different products, and therefore, if such a article are made for them, they would need to have two different reviews for them. I'm just wondering how many people have a copy of the original Doom though.

[DarthHelmet86]

Originally Posted by Japo

Approving or rejecting a game has never been about which particular updater was online at the moment, and how did he "feel like" about the game.

If it's to be that these games are rejected, OK, but it has to be a definite criterion. About games with expansions, I still think they will catch us pants down, if we don't decide how to handle them. So far we have been deciding on the already abandoned ones on a per case basis, instead of having any rule like for the rest, as we should.

I wasn't saying hey lets all just do what we want, rather lets not bicker like children over a game that is being sold anyway.

[TotalAnarchy]

As far as expansions go, a couple were already approved, Wages of Sin for SiN and Hellfire for Diablo come to mind. But there is a factor which in my opinion doesn't allow us to associate shareware episodes with expansions. Expansions were sold, shareware episodes were not. Not mentioning the fact that noone considers these episodes as separate full games, there's also the fact that abandonware in AB rules implies it was commercially distributed at a time, which shareware was obviously not.

Now this makes things interesting. There's the problem with Commander Keen again. Thus I'd advise we should not make separate pages for every episode, but rather for every batch. Eps 1,2,3 were clearly sold as Commander Keen: Invasion of the Vorticons, and 4 and 5 were Commander Keen: Goodbye Galaxy! So I'd suggest we review them as 3D Realms themselves distributes them:

- http://www.3drealms.com/keen1/
- http://www.3drealms.com/keen4/

...plus the others which were distributed separately (3.5, 6)

Now regarding the aforementioned expansion. Doing reviews for them is not exactly a problem. The problem occurs that they can't be run without the original game (both Diablo and SiN are sold), and current policy doesn't allow us to upload ISOs/cd images, but only the zipped installed folder. So how will we get out of this situation.

[Professor Oak]

Originally Posted by TotalAnarchy

Now regarding the aforementioned expansion. Doing reviews for them is not exactly a problem. The problem occurs that they can't be run without the original game (both Diablo and SiN are sold), and current policy doesn't allow us to upload ISOs/cd images, but only the zipped installed folder. So how will we get out of this situation.

If I'm honest, if the expansions are not being sold or there is little interest for them in regards to those who released them, then I would say that the submission of ISOs for them should be reasonable until such a time when such expansions are once again sold. However, this topic could do with a little bit of discussion from both sides of the divide in regards to policy.

[DarthHelmet86]

Its not just Commander Keen though, Apogee did it a lot. Crystal Caves, Secret Agent have multiple episodes launched from seperate .exes, the first one being Shareware. These games are meant to come together but are seperated by episode. I agree that if we do host them it should be in the full versions of each game how they were intended.